Cloud have been across Australia the last 8 day and still is there.

News break Solar panel now works in the dark according to numbskull, United States Congress now approves the roll out of Numbskull policy, News break numbskull policy send United States economy to the verge of bankruptcy two weeks later.

Numbskull I told you didn’t work on cloudy dark days.

Bob, I can see from the satellite what a tree lumberjack you are.

It is winter down there, a string of cloudy days is possible. And he’s probably sweating his job.

He should get out of the hole and get himself trained to install solar and wind. Pass on a better world to the next generation rather than play a part in their suffering.

What are you talking about the tax payer’s dollars assisting me paying for the solar system, what you have a magical vacuum cleaner that moves the pitch black clouds along do you?

My grid inverter doesn’t have a crank handle you know, go back to the dark ages where you belong . The hole you crawled out of.

Let’s put some numbers to that…

In 2002 coal produced 50.1% of all US electricity. By the middle of 2012 that number had fallen to 36%, a loss of 14.1%.

Natural gas increased, during the same period from 17.9% to 31%. An increase of 13.1%.

Renewables, including hydro, increased from 9% to 13%, a 4% share increase.

Petroleum dropped from 2.4% to 0.5% during the same time frame.

Coal and petroleum lost 17% of total production, NG and renewables picked up 17.1% with about 75% of that going to NG. But it was only in 2008 that renewables started to show higher growth rates.

Renewables are now growing at a higher rate than NG.

Bob has already answered well for me.

You said: “Nat gas has displaced most of the coal that has gone offline.”

Yes, NG has replaced most of the lost coal power, but it is not alone. Wind has replaced a very significant portion. Demand for electricity is down to a small degree because of end-of-grid solar installations. As Bob points out the price of NG is no longer going down because of the cost of fracking. The cost of wind and solar continue to drop at a surprising rate. The subsidies for wind and solar are helping that happen. The far larger annual dollar amount of subsidies for oil, coal, and NG are not reducing their cost. …and fossil fuel subsidies have been in place for a century. Gee, which do you think is the better deal right now? You should write to your congressional and senate reps right now and ask them to stop the fossil fuel tax breaks and subsidies if you are a true fiscal conservative! Don’t do that if you are just a hypocrite.

Yes, the coal producers are clueless. Maybe you are one. They are grasping at keeping market share as they lose their economic position going forward. As wind, solar, and energy storage continue to drop in price …that kerosene distribution business might not be as profitable as those Edison electric bulbs …or you can continue to demand that customers buy your kerosene like they did at the turn of the century in Europe. They still lost in the long run. This change to lower and lower cost renewables is happening. Please pull your own head out of the sand, or at least get out of our way! The cost trends here are very clear. You have scales on your eyes if you cannot see this.

If coal companies understood the change that is happening, then they would be investing in solar and wind, instead of fighting it. A few over-seas oil companies are actually doing this. It is common for large incumbent companies to try and block technical progress and protect their long established empire. This is especially true here, where they think they have us depending on a limited resource so they can crank up the price. Sorry, not gunna happen on my watch.

Tobacco causes cancer.

CO2 causes global warming.

Wind is already competitive with new coal plants for source-of-grid power. …and wind is still getting cheaper.

Installed Solar PV is already lower than end-of-grid electricity in Australia, Hawaii, some parts of Southern California, and others …and installed Solar PV is still dropping in price. It will be the lowest cost option, with no subsidies, for the whole southern half of the USA before the end of this decade.

Rationalize this differently if you want, but these are the realities.

We saw this last December when Republican governors from red states lobbied Congress for continued federal support for the wind industry.

Their citizens were making money off wind. It was bringing business and tax revenues to small towns which had been dying. New tax money was flowing into state budgets.

And you are only temporarily correct. The price of NG is rising and renewable capacity is increasing. The percentage of electricity produced by NG will shift toward renewables as wind and solar become cheaper and gas more expensive.

With wind becoming cheaper than NG more wind will be installed because it not only saves utilities money now, it locks in those low prices for 25 to 30 years. Possibly more.

With solar now cheaper than gas peaker power utilities will install more solar in order to avoid paying for gas peaker power and to lock in those low prices for 40 or more years.

Coal, like nuclear, is in deep trouble. Coal must either clean up its emission stream or get shut down. We just can’t afford to foot the medical bill for coal any longer.

Coal can’t clean up its smokestack emissions and compete. It will lose money at night when wind can price out below it and it can’t make that loss up during peak hours by having expensive gas peakers set high merit order ceilings. Solar has lowered that ceiling.

The old model no longer works. We’re moving into the 21st Century where having a zero fuel cost makes you a winner.
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All energy is subsidized. Renewables have received only a very small percentage of what fossil fuels have received.

Many politicians and the much of the media, in the USA and Australia, are doing the bidding of big money. They are bought and paid for. It no longer matters and neither does climate change. We’re now at the tipping point. Solar and Wind are now the cheapest sources of electricity in some areas. Their cost is still falling. They will be the cheapest in many more areas, resulting in a huge market, in the near future. Many politicians who are now against renewables will be claiming they invented them by the end of this decade. Companies who are still selling oil lamps, kerosene lamps, horse buggies etc. (i.e. the coal and oil companies) are going to take a fall. The cost trends are very clear. It is just economics now. Some politicians have figured this out others will be learning that lesson. A politician might as well be apposed to the automobile, airplane, electric lights, computers, cell phones… A position against renewables, against solar and wind in particular, will be just the same.

You are probably already using solar and wind from the grid and you don’t know it. You better build your own private coal plant if you want to keep using just coal. The rest of us rational

Sorry Charlie think up a better story next time.

We know, for example, if we connect a couple of wind farms separated over a couple of hundred miles we get significant wind input 85% of the time. And that happens to be the amount of time a coal plant is on line on average per year.

We also know that small wind turbines aren’t a great way to generate electricity. One needs to get up high, to about 80 meters to tap into the good stuff.

Now, you’re rambling on about coal. I suppose you’re here to make some great attempt to defend the coal industry. Otherwise you’d be including our other methods of generating electricity.

Tell us, where do you live? Where do coal plants send FiT payments to homeowners?

Yes the coal generator gives me the lifestyle under the FIT payments system, without the current coal generator in place, I would not got subsidise for my $25,000 profit so far this year, I’m well aware the coal generators produce CO2 emission but that where my FIT payments are coming from, but where do you think I’m going to get the energy to keep AC ducted heating energy on, from?, If you attained that attitude of closing down the coal generator.

You can’t just say close down coal generators, I believe your wrong on that. My Neighbour installed two 50 kW wind turbines haven’t been strong enough wind to generate anything significant to even supply his own home last 2 month, turbine blades are standing still, he also is dependent upon the coal generator for energy needs, he also gets the FIT payments from the coal generator, so the coal generators must remain open the to retainer FIT payments maintaining our lifestyle. Otherwise who’s paying?

It’s only when you accept that imminent action is required to halt global warming does that strategy turn out to be a poor one.

It’s been cloudy, solid cover, and rainy here. My system hasn’t been giving me a lot, but I do get some power. If you’re getting zero and it’s been brighter than “dead of night” then you’ve got a problem.

And I don’t know where you live, but anywhere in the US your grid is supplying you electricity that is not 100% coal produced. Overall coal plays only a 35% role on the US grids.

And this – ” coal generator gives us the lifestyle to use free coal energy 24 hours a day”. Boy, it that ever a bogus claim. Coal is our #1 most expensive way to put power on the grid. I guess no one has told you that you’re paying a lot of tax money and health insurance premium money to cover the cost of coal pollution, eh?

You’re way behind the curve, Charlie. Read along and catch up.