Comments on: Lithium-Ion Battery that Charges 120 Times Faster than Normal Developed

By: Marylandbob

Marylandbob — Sun, 29 Sep 2013 14:29:00 +0000

I see the “Electric Vehicle Gas Stations” having a very LARGE BATTERY BANK on site, and just as our present gasoline and diesel refueling stations store fuel for multiple refillings of vehicles, they would do the same for electric vehicles. If the big battery were charged at a rate equal to what is needed to charge two cars in an hour, then, in a day, this big battery could then be used to “Fast Charge” at least 40 cars! ( I did not say 48, as some power losses will be involved, and totally depleting the battery is not advisable.)-Such a battery should be capable of megawatt level storage, for use in an electric refueling station, and I feel that even WITH availability of the power, a ONE MINUTE charge rate may entail many more problems than a slower, 6 to 15 minute rate, which would favorably compare with our fresent liquid fueling rate, and greatly relax the amperages and conductor sizes required to transport this energy into the vehicle battery! (Safety would be greater, and heating losses would be much less, charging at 10 minutes instead of 1 minute.) As I understand it, TESLA automobiles is incorporating on-site battery storage of electricity, AND solar power, at some of its vehicle charging facilities, to reduce demand on the A.C. Power grid. Without such storage and augmentation, quickly charging FOUR of the TESLA cars, with each having a 85,000 watt-hour battery, would require at least 320,000 watts for one hour to charge them in one hour, or 3,200,000 watts for 6 minutes to charge in 6 minutes, and 19,200,000 watts to charge these 4 cars in 6 minutes, not accounting for added power required to compensate for power lost due to heating!–No matter how you look at it, MOST neighborhoods electrical service is NOT up to providing additional 6 minute demands of 19.2 Million watts! I see some type of “on-site storage/generation” as being essential to large scale deployment of quick-charge facilities!

By: Bob_Wallace

Bob_Wallace — Sun, 29 Sep 2013 03:20:00 +0000

If you’re charging a stream of EVs rather than only one once in a while you’re still going to be in need of a great big feed.

Slow charging a battery might mean being able to charge only one EV over a multiple hour period.

If we go the rapid charge route then we’re going to need to run a big supply to the chargers.

By: Marylandbob

Marylandbob — Sun, 29 Sep 2013 03:13:00 +0000

I see the need for a different outlook on charge facilities, with the most practical being a charger that would contain a large BATTERY, which would be slowly charged by grid and/or solar power, and then be used to rapidly DUMP its charge into the device having the fast charge battery, and afterwards, the chargers battery would once again, SLOWLY recover its energy by recharging from the grid/solar connection, to be ready for the next rapid charge cycle. Operating in that manner would do away with the need for extremely heavy amperage A.C. Circuits and greatly reduce peak kilowatt demand, enabling such charging to be supplied using existing outlets! ( sort of like filling your bathtub in 5 seconds-Install as very LARGE water line and faucet, or use the existing water line to slowly fill a 200 gallon tank on the roof, then connect a big pipe from the tub to the roof tank, and open the valve, to quickly filll the tub!)

By: wattleberry

wattleberry — Fri, 29 Mar 2013 23:46:00 +0000

In considering the expense of the batteries, I didn’t see any mention of their life-expectancy.
What this development did, though, was to give a glimpse of the taxation possibilities of simply installing a dedicated socket on each vehicle so they would be forced to recharge at the installations at filling stations. It would not be welcome to consumers but you can bet it would guarantee enthusiastic government backing to the changeover!

By: linda518

linda518 — Fri, 29 Mar 2013 18:35:00 +0000

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By: UKGary

UKGary — Fri, 29 Mar 2013 11:02:00 +0000

These batteries would be ideal for plug in hybrids with a high power electric motor and low power internal combustion engine (range extender). That way, the battery pack could be kept to a size that allows perhaps 20 to 30 miles, and the very high power characteristics of the battery would allow for exceptionally efficient regenerative breaking, nippy performance, and low vehicle weight.

There are four further advantages I can see in these batteries.

1. As internal resistance is orders of magnitude less, resistive losses during charging and discharging will be greatly reduced – making the batteries very efficient in their cycling.

2. Low internal resistance in lithium batteries often goes hand in hand with enhanced cycle life – it is likely that these batteries will last for many more charge cycles than other lithium battery designs.

3. With such a reduction in internal resistance, the design of very large cells is greatly simplified so that even with the higher costs of the technology in general, the specific costs of very large cells >1,000 AH is likely to be lower.

4. With very high power capabilities both charging and discharging, these batteries are ideal for static application in electrical grid stability control – able to deliver or absorb megawatts with millisecond reaction time – allowing time for generators and other sources of spinning reserve to ramp up or down.

By: Zachary Shahan

Zachary Shahan — Thu, 20 Sep 2012 23:03:00 +0000

getting back to the heart of cleantech.

thanks for the comment/refresher.

well said.

By: blacky9er

blacky9er — Mon, 17 Sep 2012 18:17:00 +0000

Obviously some of you have never seen the smog/filth in the air from the gas and diesel powered vehicles in places like L.A. California in the late 1960’s. Or perhaps in the future all of the country of China. And the middle class who can afford to use Cadillacs and Mercedes as daily commuters. Expensive I don’t think so. I don’t care how “expensive” being clean has no price tag. You should try living next to Interstate 5 in L.A. then you will understand what unhealthy is.

By: Stan Stein

Stan Stein — Wed, 12 Sep 2012 13:33:00 +0000

Oh please….paying $43,000 for a Volt is no worse than the regular price of $40,000……it’s just another $80 per month for a car that you can actually USE.

By: Bob_Wallace

Bob_Wallace — Wed, 12 Sep 2012 04:07:00 +0000

Taxis and buses. Vehicles that need to stay moving. A few taxi and bus stops could be wired with big pipes and vehicles could take on some range as they loaded passengers.

By: Bob_Wallace

Bob_Wallace — Tue, 11 Sep 2012 18:46:00 +0000

Just to put a bit of icing on your comment…

The average driver piles up less than 35 miles a day. With a normal 240vac outlet one could recharge in about 1.5 hours.

Most cars are going to get parked at least 9-10 hours per night. That’s more than enough for a complete charge even if you had a 200 mile range battery.

There’s no need for faster charging except on long trips.

By: sola

sola — Tue, 11 Sep 2012 18:29:00 +0000

Obviously, you will not try to charge a battery like this from a garden-variety 100/240V outlet.

Quite likely, you will use public charging stations or a dedicated home charger which has a dedicated connection to the grid (and a special, demand-managed meter in it).

In any case, there is no point in charging like this at home since you would be in no hurry. You arrive at home, put the car on the charger and it will be charged by the morning.

Public charging stations on the other hand will have properly designed, huge connections and will be able to handle the currents needed. This would actually make public stations viable since they could serve a car in every 1-5 minutes.

By: sola

sola — Tue, 11 Sep 2012 18:22:00 +0000

Yes, this would seriously improve the regen capability of hybrids/EVs with smaller battery packs.

And regen ratios are extremely important in city driving so this advancement could make hybrids and EVs even more efficient and thus cost effective to own.

By: sola

sola — Tue, 11 Sep 2012 18:16:00 +0000

Very good argument and I very much agree.

If this ultra-quick charge capability doesn’t make the battery much more expensible (a 10% plus is absolutely acceptable for this capabality) then we can say that this is revolutionary.

By: Bob_Wallace

Bob_Wallace — Tue, 11 Sep 2012 18:15:00 +0000

In your garage is not where we need very rapid charging.

We need very rapid charging along our major travel routes.

We’ll run the really big wires where they are needed.

By: Captivation

Captivation — Tue, 11 Sep 2012 18:13:00 +0000

With charging that fast, the preferred option will be a lightning rod.

By: Nicholas

Nicholas — Tue, 11 Sep 2012 17:58:00 +0000

”
Being able to charge quickly is convenient, but it doesn’t get around the fact that li-ion battery packs are incredibly expensive

Sorry, but I disagree with that statement. Charge time is of paramount importance. It can help the cost situation by facilitating smaller batteries, because fast charging batteries can easily be recharged in public places.

The large, longer range batteries in use today are much bigger than fast-charging batteries would need to be.

Fast charging batteries just need to provide a range long enough to get you to a charging station whenever necessary.

It also means that setting up charging stations will be worth it because right now, sitting in public with an older EV for 3 to 8 hours while it charges is not feasible. 1 minute is.

By: Nicholas

Nicholas — Tue, 11 Sep 2012 17:54:00 +0000

That would deliver 990 Wh (you can round that off to a kWh) in one minute. Outlets of this type would have to be connected to the power lines outside. Whenever anything such as large industrial systems require huge amounts of power even more than this, they connect them to the power lines.

There is no blackout issue like what you mentioned, or everybody would lose power every time factories start up, for example, or anything industrial for that matter.

Power lines provide more than enough at night.

By: Pedro Coolinoza

Pedro Coolinoza — Tue, 11 Sep 2012 17:39:00 +0000

This sounds very nice but is has some “real world issues”:
Lets see. In order to charge a 1Kwh battery in 1 minute you need some serious power supply: You would need a 270A power line at 220V. This is nothing you will easily get in your garage. It will not only switch off the lights in your house, it will take care of your neighbors houses too.
To charge your iPad3 in a minute, you would need a 5V 510A Power supply which will cost more than 10 iPads. The wires in the iPad would be 3 times bigger than the iPad itself. You would need a 120V 22A Wall outlet

By: anderlan

anderlan — Tue, 11 Sep 2012 17:34:00 +0000

Remember the hubub over supercapacitors because they would have allowed more efficient regenerative braking? Well, this is pretty close to that. Expect hydrids to partake of this if the cost is low enough. Also, with recharge (braking) power at hundreds of kilowatts, I expect this technology could be used to finally make road freight hybrid power trains very attractive.