Comments on: Solar Energy Storage Pilot Project

By: Kyle Sager helioshirt.com

Kyle Sager helioshirt.com — Sat, 26 May 2012 01:13:00 +0000

& btw…that’s a big point of storage…prevent damage.

By: Kyle Sager helioshirt.com

Kyle Sager helioshirt.com — Sat, 26 May 2012 01:10:00 +0000

Let me see if I get you straight. Johnny5 equates solar to grid damage. He doesn’t qualify the proclamation. He leads with it with everything but a big punctuation mark. He responds to an article about Chicago with Australia (which you back) While German residents justifiably lay claim to the largest, most brilliant and successful solar experiment in all human history; and they have no such problem. Maybe Australia’s situation’s unique. But that’s not what Johhny5 said. Johnny5 equated chicago to australia. The United States harbors nearly 4 times the population of Germany. So what’s really going on here? Fear mongering. Attempts to obfuscate – to cloud beautiful trails that have been blazed in places like Germany. I salute Germany. They did it all WITH LESS SUN. If we were real leaders we’d be matching their scale here. Bravo to S&C electric. I applaud you.

By: Mike

Mike — Mon, 30 Apr 2012 13:43:00 +0000

What home uses 1.5kw so your talking about capping home to 1.5kw per hour over 50 house which is 1.5kw X 24 hour = 36kw, 36kw X 50(houses) = 1800kw per day over 50 house no battery can supply that power level from 75kw battery pack.

By: Sam

Sam — Mon, 30 Apr 2012 13:31:00 +0000

1kw is 1kwh; an appliance that draws 1kw over the hour is 1kwh. They is no defences 1kw is over time 60 min is 1kwh.

By: Sam

Sam — Mon, 30 Apr 2012 13:24:00 +0000

Yes that right 1kw is 1kwh, an appliance that draws 1kw over the hour is 1kwh.

By: Jim

Jim — Mon, 30 Apr 2012 13:14:00 +0000

Jonny5 is right; in Australia grid solar power has cause high main voltage to exceed 240v main AC power. Grid inverter has raised power voltage levels above 283vac & even higher than 300vac. Houses near by have suffered appliances damage, running hot and caused house fires as a direct cause of grid solar power. There is also legal action against the grid solar power homes that generated power back to the grid because of the voltage surges that solar power delivers to the grid.

By: Zachary Shahan

Zachary Shahan — Fri, 27 Apr 2012 22:03:00 +0000

yeah, i took that to mean, at any given time.

By: Clement Cadisch

Clement Cadisch — Thu, 26 Apr 2012 21:07:00 +0000

As a mere measure for power, 1.5 kW has to be time-related in order to express a measure for energy — be it only by specifying that power has to be supplied at an average level of 1.5 kW in order to sustain a single household, whereby the time factor is “all the time, i. e. permanently”.

Is there a symbol for ‘permanently’? Could it be rms (root mean square), i. e. 1.5 kWrms?).

By: JoeTaxpayer

JoeTaxpayer — Thu, 26 Apr 2012 20:15:00 +0000

Has storage become cheap enough that it’s preferable to store (solar-produced) power than to push it to the grid?
I know for solar, the first tipping point is for it to pay for itself in the highest cost/highest return areas, but thought storage still had a ways to go. That installations were typically only for as-needed with little to push or store.

By: Zachary Shahan

Zachary Shahan — Thu, 26 Apr 2012 15:18:00 +0000

from Howard C. Hayden, Ph.D., professor emeritus of physics at the University of Connecticut and adjunct professor at Colorado State University at Pueblo:

“From the standpoint of the power station, the utility needs to produce less than about 1.5 kilowatts per household.”

( http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_many_kilowatts_power_an_average_house#ixzz1t9yTJdcj )

By: Zachary Shahan

Zachary Shahan — Thu, 26 Apr 2012 15:17:00 +0000

no, not kWh, but kW (as stated).

also, forgot to include the source in the article — just added that, but if you don’t want to scroll up, this is it: http://www.businessgreen.com/bg/news/2168712/-electric-pilot-round-clock-solar-power

And from Howard C. Hayden, Ph.D., professor emeritus of physics at the University of Connecticut and adjunct professor at Colorado State University at Pueblo:

“From the standpoint of the power station, the utility needs to produce less than about 1.5 kilowatts per household.”

( http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_many_kilowatts_power_an_average_house#ixzz1t9yTJdcj )

By: Zachary Shahan

Zachary Shahan — Thu, 26 Apr 2012 15:14:00 +0000

you’re thinking kwh, not kw

By: ThomasGerke

ThomasGerke — Wed, 25 Apr 2012 20:01:00 +0000

That’s a popular argument. But I do not think that it’s a valid point.
1. Germany has not unlimited interconnection space with it’s neighbours.
2. Germany is also made up of different regions and areas.
In theory Germany could have 75-90 GW of PV Solar output at a given moment of the day and use it all by itself. So the limit isn’t nearly reached.

The problem is that the existing power plants are not flexible enough to make space for solar quick enough and there isn’t enough local storage / grid capacity to make full use of solar power in a decentralized fashion.
That’s not really a problem of PV solar, that’s a problem of the conventional power system being designed in an outdated 19th/20th century fashion. It has to change since it’s extremly inefficant and the main contributor to the water, climate and energy crisis of the world.

And because many parts of the system are in dire need of replacement anyways (so change will happen, so we might as well make it a good change)

By: perfsolar

perfsolar — Wed, 25 Apr 2012 20:00:00 +0000

Correct Bill, sorry meant 5%. But that 5% equates to billions lost annually. DC power when converted to AC only loses 1% due to inverter efficiency. Electric storage locally will be where its at.

http://large.stanford.edu/courses/2010/ph240/harting1/

By: Bill_Woods

Bill_Woods — Wed, 25 Apr 2012 19:34:00 +0000

Germany is part of a much larger region, with the capability of exporting several GW of surplus power. That’s not really an option for Australia.

By: Bill_Woods

Bill_Woods — Wed, 25 Apr 2012 19:01:00 +0000

Transmission losses are more like 10%. Long-range, high-voltage transmission loses ~3% per 1000 km.

By: perfsolar

perfsolar — Wed, 25 Apr 2012 15:20:00 +0000

Energy storage will be in the near future. With 50% power produced from plants lost in transmission, it only makes sense for storage to be made available. This means we can use solar plants to produce at peak times and stored for future use. This will allow our power grid to be more modular and less dependent on a few main sources.

They may not have taken plants off line but no new plants have been built either. You will continue to hear this argument from coal and oil. Burn baby, Burn….

By: Captivation

Captivation — Wed, 25 Apr 2012 14:00:00 +0000

In a sense we are all energy nomads who live hand to mouth / moment by moment, with no ability to store energy for future use. I saw this clearly in the blackout of 2003. One moment people had ample energy, while an instant later they would do almost anything for a few watts to power the lights, or the fridge, or the radio, or the elevator.

Its a bit like driving your car with the fuel gauge always close to empty. In the future it will be unthinkable to not have at least a day’s supply of energy stored in batteries. Even if there is a small cost attached to this, it will be compensated by the ability to purchase and store energy when prices get low. Many people do the same thing with groceries. Having a fridge is an investment. But that investment can be gradually paid off by the savings from the ability to store sale priced groceries longer. In the future living with battery power will be like living without a fridge.

By: ThomasGerke

ThomasGerke — Wed, 25 Apr 2012 13:48:00 +0000

25 GW of solar capacity on the grid here in Germany… pumping up to 18 GW of capacity into the grid as of now (April). But the grid is stable. Addapting the low-voltage distribution grid is actually neccessary anyways & expanding it to be smart-grid ready is cheaper than building new power lines.

If there are so many problems in Australia, it’s bad coordination at the level of the grid operators… are they independent or are they owned by the companies that own the coal power stations?

By: No

No — Wed, 25 Apr 2012 13:14:00 +0000

None taken offline (coal stations), but none added.