Comments on: New Energy Project Will Be Even Larger than the Pickens Plan http://cleantechnica.com/2008/09/16/new-energy-project-will-be-even-larger-than-the-pickens-plan/ Clean Tech News & Views: Solar Energy News. Wind Energy News. EV News. & More. Fri, 25 May 2012 17:05:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.2 By: Uncle B http://cleantechnica.com/2008/09/16/new-energy-project-will-be-even-larger-than-the-pickens-plan/#comment-2561 Uncle B Thu, 18 Sep 2008 23:35:51 +0000 http://cleantechnica.com/?p=1089#comment-2561 Wind power is great, but it won't be enough If the U.S. had chosen to be a moral people, and leaving Iraqi oil alone, and following Al Gore, decided to develop the South Western deserts, with the technology of the times - solar/thermal-molten sodium - electricity installations, for the same amount of money as that war cost, ($650 Billion), today, we would be tapping into the largest, renewable, sustainable, energy source the world has ever known. It would have paid every energy bill in the U.S.A. for maintenance fees only - FOREVER! It would be equivalent to an oil field that can NEVER run dry! Low cost electric power, and storeable hydrogen gasoline replacement from the electricity, for all! After the millions of murders, and $650 billions of dollars, borrowed from our children’s futures and pissed away, with thousands of our own and others maimed and disfigured for life, millions of families utterly destroyed, ours and theirs, we are no closer to Iraqi oil production than the Iraqis are! The next time you hear a blithering idiot spoiled brat, drunken, drug addicted, sociopath, rich Arabic saber dancing daddie’s boy oilman, stand at a microphone and threaten YOUR safety with someone ELSE’S weapons, remember what you lost America, remember, and weep! (also see http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=a-solar-grand-plan) Wind power is great, but it won’t be enough If the U.S. had chosen to be a moral people, and leaving Iraqi oil alone, and following Al Gore, decided to develop the South Western deserts, with the technology of the times – solar/thermal-molten sodium – electricity installations, for the same amount of money as that war cost, ($650 Billion), today, we would be tapping into the largest, renewable, sustainable, energy source the world has ever known. It would have paid every energy bill in the U.S.A. for maintenance fees only – FOREVER! It would be equivalent to an oil field that can NEVER run dry! Low cost electric power, and storeable hydrogen gasoline replacement from the electricity, for all!

After the millions of murders, and $650 billions of dollars, borrowed from our children’s futures and pissed away, with thousands of our own and others maimed and disfigured for life, millions of families utterly destroyed, ours and theirs, we are no closer to Iraqi oil production than the Iraqis are!

The next time you hear a blithering idiot spoiled brat, drunken, drug addicted, sociopath, rich Arabic saber dancing daddie’s boy oilman, stand at a microphone and threaten YOUR safety with someone ELSE’S weapons, remember what you lost America, remember, and weep! (also see http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=a-solar-grand-plan)

]]> By: Uncle B http://cleantechnica.com/2008/09/16/new-energy-project-will-be-even-larger-than-the-pickens-plan/#comment-19572 Uncle B Thu, 18 Sep 2008 23:35:00 +0000 http://cleantechnica.com/?p=1089#comment-19572 Wind power is great, but it won't be enough If the U.S. had chosen to be a moral people, and leaving Iraqi oil alone, and following Al Gore, decided to develop the South Western deserts, with the technology of the times - solar/thermal-molten sodium - electricity installations, for the same amount of money as that war cost, ($650 Billion), today, we would be tapping into the largest, renewable, sustainable, energy source the world has ever known. It would have paid every energy bill in the U.S.A. for maintenance fees only - FOREVER! It would be equivalent to an oil field that can NEVER run dry! Low cost electric power, and storeable hydrogen gasoline replacement from the electricity, for all! After the millions of murders, and $650 billions of dollars, borrowed from our children’s futures and pissed away, with thousands of our own and others maimed and disfigured for life, millions of families utterly destroyed, ours and theirs, we are no closer to Iraqi oil production than the Iraqis are! The next time you hear a blithering idiot spoiled brat, drunken, drug addicted, sociopath, rich Arabic saber dancing daddie’s boy oilman, stand at a microphone and threaten YOUR safety with someone ELSE’S weapons, remember what you lost America, remember, and weep! (also see http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=a-solar-grand-plan) Wind power is great, but it won’t be enough If the U.S. had chosen to be a moral people, and leaving Iraqi oil alone, and following Al Gore, decided to develop the South Western deserts, with the technology of the times – solar/thermal-molten sodium – electricity installations, for the same amount of money as that war cost, ($650 Billion), today, we would be tapping into the largest, renewable, sustainable, energy source the world has ever known. It would have paid every energy bill in the U.S.A. for maintenance fees only – FOREVER! It would be equivalent to an oil field that can NEVER run dry! Low cost electric power, and storeable hydrogen gasoline replacement from the electricity, for all!

After the millions of murders, and $650 billions of dollars, borrowed from our children’s futures and pissed away, with thousands of our own and others maimed and disfigured for life, millions of families utterly destroyed, ours and theirs, we are no closer to Iraqi oil production than the Iraqis are!

The next time you hear a blithering idiot spoiled brat, drunken, drug addicted, sociopath, rich Arabic saber dancing daddie’s boy oilman, stand at a microphone and threaten YOUR safety with someone ELSE’S weapons, remember what you lost America, remember, and weep! (also see http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=a-solar-grand-plan)

]]> By: Rod Adams http://cleantechnica.com/2008/09/16/new-energy-project-will-be-even-larger-than-the-pickens-plan/#comment-2560 Rod Adams Wed, 17 Sep 2008 17:47:31 +0000 http://cleantechnica.com/?p=1089#comment-2560 Ariel: I am not sure why you are so excited about this announcement. Look at the numbers - the wind component of the announced project is described as being 1,000 MW out of a planned 8,000 MW total that includes "renewables, natural gas and coal-fired power plants". Since wind developers normally advertise their system CAPACITY, not output, that means that the wind component will be about 333 MW when average capacity factor is taken into account compared to perhaps 6,000 MW of fossil fuel power when those capacity factors are included. Building new coal fired plants now locks us in to 60 or more years of burning a dirty fuel that is not only an air pollution problem, but that also causes a significant negative environmental impact on the mining, transportation and solid waste disposal portion of the fuel cycle. In other words, I think that the wind component of this project is strictly diversionary and designed to gain the approval of "the green community". It did not succeed for me. Ariel:

I am not sure why you are so excited about this announcement. Look at the numbers – the wind component of the announced project is described as being 1,000 MW out of a planned 8,000 MW total that includes “renewables, natural gas and coal-fired power plants”.

Since wind developers normally advertise their system CAPACITY, not output, that means that the wind component will be about 333 MW when average capacity factor is taken into account compared to perhaps 6,000 MW of fossil fuel power when those capacity factors are included.

Building new coal fired plants now locks us in to 60 or more years of burning a dirty fuel that is not only an air pollution problem, but that also causes a significant negative environmental impact on the mining, transportation and solid waste disposal portion of the fuel cycle.

In other words, I think that the wind component of this project is strictly diversionary and designed to gain the approval of “the green community”. It did not succeed for me.

]]> By: Rod Adams http://cleantechnica.com/2008/09/16/new-energy-project-will-be-even-larger-than-the-pickens-plan/#comment-19571 Rod Adams Wed, 17 Sep 2008 17:47:00 +0000 http://cleantechnica.com/?p=1089#comment-19571 Ariel: I am not sure why you are so excited about this announcement. Look at the numbers - the wind component of the announced project is described as being 1,000 MW out of a planned 8,000 MW total that includes "renewables, natural gas and coal-fired power plants". Since wind developers normally advertise their system CAPACITY, not output, that means that the wind component will be about 333 MW when average capacity factor is taken into account compared to perhaps 6,000 MW of fossil fuel power when those capacity factors are included. Building new coal fired plants now locks us in to 60 or more years of burning a dirty fuel that is not only an air pollution problem, but that also causes a significant negative environmental impact on the mining, transportation and solid waste disposal portion of the fuel cycle. In other words, I think that the wind component of this project is strictly diversionary and designed to gain the approval of "the green community". It did not succeed for me. Ariel:

I am not sure why you are so excited about this announcement. Look at the numbers – the wind component of the announced project is described as being 1,000 MW out of a planned 8,000 MW total that includes “renewables, natural gas and coal-fired power plants”.

Since wind developers normally advertise their system CAPACITY, not output, that means that the wind component will be about 333 MW when average capacity factor is taken into account compared to perhaps 6,000 MW of fossil fuel power when those capacity factors are included.

Building new coal fired plants now locks us in to 60 or more years of burning a dirty fuel that is not only an air pollution problem, but that also causes a significant negative environmental impact on the mining, transportation and solid waste disposal portion of the fuel cycle.

In other words, I think that the wind component of this project is strictly diversionary and designed to gain the approval of “the green community”. It did not succeed for me.

]]> By: Eastcoasty http://cleantechnica.com/2008/09/16/new-energy-project-will-be-even-larger-than-the-pickens-plan/#comment-2559 Eastcoasty Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:49:24 +0000 http://cleantechnica.com/?p=1089#comment-2559 Misleading article. They're planning also non-renewables including COAL. Wind could be 10% of their 8,000 MW, for all the information we have here, or 800 MW. The article states: "...8,000 MW of power from renewables, natural gas, and coal-fired plants." The article quotes an initial "79.5 MW plant", with plans for only "567.5" MW in several states. That's far below T. Boone's 4,000 MW in Texas alone. Misleading article. They’re planning also non-renewables including COAL. Wind could be 10% of their 8,000 MW, for all the information we have here, or 800 MW.

The article states: “…8,000 MW of power from renewables, natural gas, and coal-fired plants.”

The article quotes an initial “79.5 MW plant”, with plans for only “567.5″ MW in several states. That’s far below T. Boone’s 4,000 MW in Texas alone.

]]> By: Eastcoasty http://cleantechnica.com/2008/09/16/new-energy-project-will-be-even-larger-than-the-pickens-plan/#comment-19570 Eastcoasty Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:49:00 +0000 http://cleantechnica.com/?p=1089#comment-19570 Misleading article. They're planning also non-renewables including COAL. Wind could be 10% of their 8,000 MW, for all the information we have here, or 800 MW. The article states: "...8,000 MW of power from renewables, natural gas, and coal-fired plants." The article quotes an initial "79.5 MW plant", with plans for only "567.5" MW in several states. That's far below T. Boone's 4,000 MW in Texas alone. Misleading article. They’re planning also non-renewables including COAL. Wind could be 10% of their 8,000 MW, for all the information we have here, or 800 MW.

The article states: “…8,000 MW of power from renewables, natural gas, and coal-fired plants.”

The article quotes an initial “79.5 MW plant”, with plans for only “567.5″ MW in several states. That’s far below T. Boone’s 4,000 MW in Texas alone.

]]> By: some dude http://cleantechnica.com/2008/09/16/new-energy-project-will-be-even-larger-than-the-pickens-plan/#comment-2558 some dude Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:33:35 +0000 http://cleantechnica.com/?p=1089#comment-2558 those wind generators should put out quite a bit of power the next time a hurricane comes though those wind generators should put out quite a bit of power the next time a hurricane comes though

]]> By: some dude http://cleantechnica.com/2008/09/16/new-energy-project-will-be-even-larger-than-the-pickens-plan/#comment-19569 some dude Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:33:00 +0000 http://cleantechnica.com/?p=1089#comment-19569 those wind generators should put out quite a bit of power the next time a hurricane comes though those wind generators should put out quite a bit of power the next time a hurricane comes though

]]> By: aaron http://cleantechnica.com/2008/09/16/new-energy-project-will-be-even-larger-than-the-pickens-plan/#comment-2557 aaron Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:18:38 +0000 http://cleantechnica.com/?p=1089#comment-2557 @ just watching: So glad other people are realizing this. Wind energy cannot be a full solution because of its lack of reliability. Whats more, many of those wind companies are operating recklessly...pumping power onto constrained transmission lines...and not following schedules. Anyone familiar with the operation of mass power grids knows the 8000mw in the panhandle they are talking about is going to be a nightmare. There isnt enough transmission in all of texas to get it to market...and i got news for y'all...no one lives in the panhandle!!! youre gonna have a lot of losses getting that power all the way to dallas. @ just watching: So glad other people are realizing this.

Wind energy cannot be a full solution because of its lack of reliability. Whats more, many of those wind companies are operating recklessly…pumping power onto constrained transmission lines…and not following schedules. Anyone familiar with the operation of mass power grids knows the 8000mw in the panhandle they are talking about is going to be a nightmare. There isnt enough transmission in all of texas to get it to market…and i got news for y’all…no one lives in the panhandle!!! youre gonna have a lot of losses getting that power all the way to dallas.

]]> By: aaron http://cleantechnica.com/2008/09/16/new-energy-project-will-be-even-larger-than-the-pickens-plan/#comment-19568 aaron Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:18:00 +0000 http://cleantechnica.com/?p=1089#comment-19568 @ just watching: So glad other people are realizing this. Wind energy cannot be a full solution because of its lack of reliability. Whats more, many of those wind companies are operating recklessly...pumping power onto constrained transmission lines...and not following schedules. Anyone familiar with the operation of mass power grids knows the 8000mw in the panhandle they are talking about is going to be a nightmare. There isnt enough transmission in all of texas to get it to market...and i got news for y'all...no one lives in the panhandle!!! youre gonna have a lot of losses getting that power all the way to dallas. @ just watching: So glad other people are realizing this.

Wind energy cannot be a full solution because of its lack of reliability. Whats more, many of those wind companies are operating recklessly…pumping power onto constrained transmission lines…and not following schedules. Anyone familiar with the operation of mass power grids knows the 8000mw in the panhandle they are talking about is going to be a nightmare. There isnt enough transmission in all of texas to get it to market…and i got news for y’all…no one lives in the panhandle!!! youre gonna have a lot of losses getting that power all the way to dallas.

]]> By: Andy http://cleantechnica.com/2008/09/16/new-energy-project-will-be-even-larger-than-the-pickens-plan/#comment-2556 Andy Wed, 17 Sep 2008 12:28:25 +0000 http://cleantechnica.com/?p=1089#comment-2556 This is the same Babcock and Brown (ASX:BNB) whose share price has dropped from over $30 to $1 in the last year. Do I hear someone say Lehman Brothers? This is the same Babcock and Brown (ASX:BNB) whose share price has dropped from over $30 to $1 in the last year. Do I hear someone say Lehman Brothers?

]]> By: Andy http://cleantechnica.com/2008/09/16/new-energy-project-will-be-even-larger-than-the-pickens-plan/#comment-19567 Andy Wed, 17 Sep 2008 12:28:00 +0000 http://cleantechnica.com/?p=1089#comment-19567 This is the same Babcock and Brown (ASX:BNB) whose share price has dropped from over $30 to $1 in the last year. Do I hear someone say Lehman Brothers? This is the same Babcock and Brown (ASX:BNB) whose share price has dropped from over $30 to $1 in the last year. Do I hear someone say Lehman Brothers?

]]> By: JIffy Loo http://cleantechnica.com/2008/09/16/new-energy-project-will-be-even-larger-than-the-pickens-plan/#comment-2555 JIffy Loo Wed, 17 Sep 2008 12:08:05 +0000 http://cleantechnica.com/?p=1089#comment-2555 Outstanding! We need a plan thats larger than life! Jiff www.anonymize.us.tc Outstanding! We need a plan thats larger than life!

Jiff

http://www.anonymize.us.tc

]]> By: JIffy Loo http://cleantechnica.com/2008/09/16/new-energy-project-will-be-even-larger-than-the-pickens-plan/#comment-19566 JIffy Loo Wed, 17 Sep 2008 12:08:00 +0000 http://cleantechnica.com/?p=1089#comment-19566 Outstanding! We need a plan thats larger than life! Jiff www.anonymize.us.tc Outstanding! We need a plan thats larger than life!

Jiff

http://www.anonymize.us.tc

]]> By: niaher http://cleantechnica.com/2008/09/16/new-energy-project-will-be-even-larger-than-the-pickens-plan/#comment-2554 niaher Wed, 17 Sep 2008 11:44:26 +0000 http://cleantechnica.com/?p=1089#comment-2554 Jon, it might be true what you say, but let's face it - it's still better than not having any windmill farms at all. Plus jobs for locals will be created regardless of who the investors are. I believe it's not such a big sacrifice, but it does help solving the global problem of the environmental crisis. Jon, it might be true what you say, but let’s face it – it’s still better than not having any windmill farms at all. Plus jobs for locals will be created regardless of who the investors are. I believe it’s not such a big sacrifice, but it does help solving the global problem of the environmental crisis.

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